Hildur Knútdóttir, November 2023

She writes about lions, witches, dueling personalities, alien invitations, and an invisible fish that brings you wings. Iceland Chicago talks with Hildur Knútsdóttir about her craft as an Icelandic author

IAC:
Hi, all.

Iceland Chicago is sitting with Hildur Knútdóttir. Personally, one of my favorite Icelandic language authors. She has written such books as Darkness Between the Stars, The Lion, The Witch, The Forest, and is with a newly released book called Hrím.

Alright, so now I’m going to try this. Please feel free to make fun of my accent.

A friend of mine says “málfræðin mín er hræðileg. Frumburðurinn minn is worse.”

IAC:
Thank you.

The goal of this eventually is to slowly have me switch over to Icelandic more and more in these interviews.

HK:
Okay, nice.
Yeah.

IAC:
Personal challenge. So, I’m not kidding. You are one of my favorite Icelandic authors. I have read The Lion, the Witch, the Forest. I have read Darkness Between… the Night Guest, I guess, and Myrkrið milli Stjarnanna, and that scared me.

That was my first Icelandic scare.

And more so to this. So, Ljónið, Iceland Chicago sponsors a Saturday, well, for us, morning reading group where we’re reading through that book. So, there’s a lot of folks who know of your work here.

HK:
Oh, thank you. Yeah, thank you. Great to hear.

IAC:
And I’m curious. So, The Lion, the Witch, and the Forest. It’s a three-book series, multiple generations, takes a supernatural turn. There’s future Iceland with the last parts of surviving civilization with a train system. And multiple generations up against, I mean, I don’t want to give too much away, but in this three-book series, how did you dream up this world?

HK:
Yeah, so I was just one day looking at housing ads, and I didn’t have any money, but I was dreaming about buying a bigger flat. And I sometimes do this. So, I came across this apartment that was on sale.
For sale, no, on sale is like with a disclosure.

So, an apartment was for sale, yes, in this house, which is a real house, which is Skóla Stræti number seven. And I didn’t know this at the time, but it’s one of the oldest houses in Reykjavík.

And so, I was just looking at the pictures, and it’s like such a weird house.
It has all these nooks and crannies, and it has like a chimney that’s like, it looks like it shouldn’t be standing up, but it is. And then it has like all these weird cabinets and the wardrobes.

And I was just so fascinated about this house, or fascinated with this house. So, and I couldn’t stop thinking about it. So, I called the estate, like the real estate agent, and basically lied and said that I wanted to buy the apartment.

So, I went there and I checked it out. And there I saw this wardrobe or a cupboard, or how would you call it? And it’s so weird. And I just knew that I had to write about it.

And I had been like, I knew sometime before that I wanted to eventually write something kind of historical about Reykjavik around the Second World War or something like that.

I’ve always been fascinated with old stuff. I mean, it’s not old compared to the thing, like the houses that on the mainland, the people on the mainland have. But I always knew that I wanted to write some kind of historical something.

And I just kept thinking about this house. And then I was in my mom’s cabin in the countryside, and I couldn’t sleep. And I was lying there, like tossing and turning and thinking about this. And then just like the story just came to me.

Like, oh, it’s three books. And there’s something going on with this, like wardrobe. And like somebody comes out. And yeah, and yeah, like, somehow I got the idea like every 79 years, that somebody like a being would come out and try to trick a girl to go with them, you know, to the other side.

And so Ljónið came quite easily (the lion). And then I realized like, that I had set myself up to write, you know, a scifi book, basically, like, and scifi book that takes place in the future. And that was quite challenging. Yeah, but it was also fun. And yeah, and then I had to write like the third book. And yeah, so I just like came to me and I think like, that writer sometimes do like, I realized as I was writing, like finishing the trilogy, — sorry, my dad, he always calls it like that. He always knows. Yeah, he can sense when I’m busy. Yeah. Yeah, so yeah, it’s quite funny, like always, like, if somebody like rings my doorbell, my dad will call me.

Yeah, so yeah, so it’s just like the story came to me and basically was born, like that, like in those couple of hours, where I lay, couldn’t sleep and I didn’t sleep much that night.

Yeah, I don’t know. Yeah. But I think like, sometimes I think like an idea for a book is usually like three ideas that I’ve been thinking about, like, something for a while, but I need like the magical ingredient and like three things or something to come together. And that happened. So like I had been thinking about writing something historical or like a mystery and yeah.

IAC:
So and then I’m kind of curious. So at first, without giving again without giving too much away, the two friends are looking for their you know, that would happen to her great aunt. And were these were these real people, Már Ogilson? Was like he actually arrested and tried for murder? Or were these?

HK:
No, no, he wasn’t. But I got them. So when they are investigating this, Kría and Elizabet, they get the they’re talking to this guy who’s called Benedict at the National. What do you call it? That where they keep all the what do you call it? Like what they sent in all the documents? It’s like a government body that keeps on

IAC:
Oh, records office.

HK:
Yeah, or something. Yeah. Yeah.So it’s the other guy that’s called Benedict. And the guy that replies to them is a real guy. I use his name, but I got his permission. So he I just I contacted them and I told them that I wanted to I was writing something like this.

IAC:
Okay, so kind of a composite of actual history.

HK:
Yeah.

IAC:
Excellent. And your your penitence for geography and actual location. It’s really cool. When I’m reading your books, I sometimes have to stop, open up a computer, go to maps, work backwards through the declension of “götu” to “gata” and actually look up a lot of these locations. When you were, for example, like in Nornin / The Witch it’s this I mean, the train system that we designed for Iceland, this is really cool. Do you have any do you have any like maps in your head about how the system would be built?

HK:
Yeah, I mean, so I did. So I based it off like, I think it’s called the hyperloop. No, what’s called like there? I based it off like, it’s like a real technology that they’re talking about. But I basically just took like the ring road device and then posted train there. I think so. Because Iceland we have like this really strong tradition of like, realist fiction that has been really strong here since the 19th century. And like people so and we’re also like really, so we’re quite often we like we joke that people like read fiction with a phone book in one hand, because they’re always like, Oh, is this one based on that one?

So they’re always like trying to like see like what’s real and what’s not. So I decided early on when I started writing that if I was writing fantastical fiction, that I at least had to have so if I was like asking people to believe that they were aliens, you know, in Iceland, I at least had to have like what’s real have it like, really concretely, you know, real.

And I just I know that like, if I would get something wrong, like, how many kilometers there are between like, like, we can be like, that like really mess up a lot of people and people would get really mad. So I, I take a lot of care to like, yeah, the things that are real and are really existing, like, yeah, I take a lot of care to have them correct.

IAC:
Yeah, I mean, it’s it’s obvious. Like, it’s, it’s really, it is really fun to, like I said, read and have a map open at the same time and try to follow along with the characters as they go.

So moving on to Myrkið milli Stjarnanna

So in my progress of learning Icelandic, and reading has been one of the accessible things to me. I owe my first laugh to a friend’s copy of Ándres Önds, Donald Duck. My first tinge of sadness was to Gunnar Theodór Eggertsson’s Steindýrin / Stone Animals. There’s a little bird. Its concrete shell cracks, and the spirit can’t leave so far from that concrete thing. And my daughter has two little birds. So that kind of hit me because it’s like, “Oh, you know, so the poor bird is gonna be left alone as the characters move on.”

I almost broke my Kindle.

I literally threw my Kindle across the room.

And I didn’t say…

IAC:
So I owe you my first real like terrorized or terror response to this book. And I’ve been rereading again. And again, same question without giving too much away. How did this come?

But I got the idea. It was kind of like a personal story. So I I’ve gotten like this, these bouts of like extreme fatigue for the past, I don’t know, like 10 years or something. And it’s only recently that I started connecting that it usually happens like after I turn in a manuscript. Like, yeah, I don’t know why it took me so long to figure it out.

So I would get like, like really tired. And I would like feel like almost like Iðunn. And so I would like wake up like super tired. And I would go to doctors and they were just like, Yeah, I mean, there’s nothing wrong with you. And, and I was just thinking about like, I feel like I’ve been out dancing or like helping someone move or something.

And so and that’s partly like, like, what would it be like if you would, you know, start really suspecting that you were out doing something?

And yeah, and so I think like this story has resonated with a lot of women. And it’s like my doctor, she told me like, at the last time she like checked and she’s like, Oh, I meet so many tired women.

She said,

IAC:
Wow.

HK: Yeah.

So, yeah. So this is like, this is what’s part of the story. And then, yeah. And yeah, and also like, I’m like, this, like the sister relationship was something that also intrigued me. I mean, I have a sister and our relationship is nothing like, like, Iðunn and Ingun. But yeah, but this is like the base, the base of the story. And in my, I might have also gotten I just realized is like some inspiration from Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell.

Have you read that?

IAC:
No, okay.

HK:
No, it’s a really so there’s a there’s a person there. And see like makes a bargain with like a fairy that he gets half her life. And she thinks that’s like he’s gonna take her when she’s 40. But, she realizes that he gets all her nights. So he has to spend all the nights dancing and you know, but I mean, it’s not like that. But I but I am. I’m not giving anything away by saying that. But yeah, that might also have been I read that but it’s like, I read it like 20 years ago, I think.

IAC:
So I have a couple questions. And this is just my own curiosity, because I’m actually I’m rereading this book now. Okay, part of what my tutor wants me to do is listen to the audiobook as I read this. And just for any other language learners out there, this is one of those good books because you have an audio book attached to it. But the chapters are extremely short; some some chapters are sentence long. So you’re able to spend 5 or 10 minutes listening and reading simultaneously. But if you get interrupted, it’s not like you have to struggle to find your place again. So just throwing that out there. So at the end of chapter two, Iðunn looks back at her reflection in the mirror, and then the reflection kind of nods back at her.

Is that one of the first foreshadows?

Have you sprinkled some for… Okay.

HK:
Yes, yes, yes.

IAC:
And in chapter 11, she’s walking back and she noticed like she starts talking about all the cats in the neighborhood.

And she’s like, she would try to attract them and help people find their missing pets. But then she’s like, but there’s another lady in the neighborhood that has a tag reader for their cats. Does this book take place in the same kind of world as a the book Urðarhvarf?

HK:
Yeah, yeah.

IAC:
Okay.

So are they just mildly entangled?

Or?

HK:
So no, I so I put this in. Because I love cats. And I like Iðunn, I know all the cats in the neighborhood. But now I have a dog. So I can’t talk to them anymore. Because like, like the dog is always with me. So I can’t like I used to always pet them and you know, but now I’m always working with my dog. So I like know the cats in the neighborhood.

And I’m always like looking if I see like a new one, like I’m like, Oh, is he like and I’ve like rescued some cats like that he’s new from here, you know, and I like monitor all the sites and there is like, because I live in the west side of Reykjavik and in our Facebook, like, group, there is a woman who has like this tag reader and seems like running around, reading the cat and I love it.

So I just put her in there, just like as a fun, like thing. And then when I got the idea for Urðarhvarf and also, yeah, and I got the idea for Urðarhvarf. I was just like, on Instagram and following these, like, people who are rescuing cats, stray cats, and it’s just like amazing. They do amazing work. And they’re like, like, they have like real stakeouts where they just like have all this equipment. And, and they like they know that they’re like kittens somewhere and it’s getting cold. So they like, they’re there, they’re there, and they won’t leave until like they have all the kittens. And I was just amazed by this. So Urðarhvarf happened. And I decided, so like, in my mind, it’s definitely like the same person. And now I was just like, so I was just sending another horror novella to copy edits today. And that’s also there’s also a cat involved there. And there’s also a person who comes to read. So it’s kind of kind of like in the same world.

IAC:
Yeah, so you you don’t stop then.

HK:
No.

Yeah, and the next, the next book I’m gonna write is also about the cat.

Like, I because, and I know so because cats are like, they’re such a great tool, I think. And they, I mean, I love cats just as animals, but also like as a literary device, because, because I mean, you could argue that cats live with us, but they’re not really tame, you know, and you could say that cats domesticated us, you know, as well as us domesticated them.

And also because here in Reykjavík, we have like so many free roaming cats, like outdoor cats, and I know cats who have just like, they’re not happy about like the food that they get in their house. So they just move, you know, they just leave. And so the, so the next book that I’m gonna write is about like, women who get to know each other. When like one of them has a cat, and he decides to move in with the other one. And he has like, and she has her kittens there, like just in her bed. And they’re like, what are they gonna do about the situation?

And the owner is like, oh, please, we can’t move her, like, because then she might like reject her kittens. So like, can she stay here for a few weeks? And she’s like, yeah, yeah, sure. And it’s like, yeah, can I visit them? So they like, so just like, about this woman and it’s like the cat just invades her life and claims her space.

IAC:
Kind of awesome. How if I can ask, like, when do you think that one’s gonna be out?

HK:
Um, I think probably 2025, I would say, but I sold the rights already to Tor Nightfire. So this one is going to come out in English as well. Yeah, but I have no idea like how the public spotlight for that is. Yeah.

IAC:
Well, just again, just for my own sake, we can get back to Darkness.

In chapter 29, “Ingunn ætlaði alltaf í viðskiptafræði” that sentence for some reason struck to me, Ingun was always intended for business. Does the death of his sister play into the supernatural in this book?And if so, or if not, kind of what part of Ingun’s demons does it play on Iðunn?

HK:
So I think I see it as like, Iðunn is haunted by her sister. And I kind of leave it up to the reader, you know, if it’s like an actual something, like if there’s a ghost or if she’s just like haunted by this, like idea, or like the presence or yeah, or the disappearance of her sister, because like her sister was like, clearly like the dominant sibling.

And she was like going places and she had all this these plans. And she was kind of like this golden child. And when she died, I think Iðunn kind of feels like that she has to also live, you know, her sister’s life and like all the expectations that her parents had for her sister, they’re just like, land on her shoulders. So I think so she feels like after her sister died, like she kind of lost a lot of choices in her life. So she is trying to live up to this potential or this or live up to this expectation.

IAC:
That makes so much sense.

That makes so much sense.

HK:
Yeah, so she’s kind of trying to live her sister’s life somehow, I think.

IAC:
I see.

Still one of my favorite books.

Pretty much ever.

Again, rereading it for the third time.

HK:
Oh, wow.

Thank you.

IAC:
And actually, the other your other series that I absolutely love, Vetrarhörkur the winter series where the world is invaded by aliens and families are running, it leads us out to the Westman Islands, and people are just trying to survive.

Again, this is, I’m gonna ask you the same question without giving too much away.

Where did this come from?

HK:
So that was based on a dream, actually.

Usually, I have like really boring dreams. I dream that I’m trying to like, I dream so many times that I’m trying to write something down on a piece of paper, but the writing is too big. So it doesn’t like say, you know, or like, I’m like missing a bus or something, something really boring. But usually, so I dream some like, I’m a participant in the dream. But one night, I think it was in like, 2000, 2000… Well, 2011 or something, probably, I had this dream, and it was just like watching a movie.

So I was not like a character in my dream. I was just like watching this young boy, and he was in Reykjavík. He was outside of my house, where I grew up. And he was completely alone. And like the safety was dark and totally empty. And in the dream, I knew that like there he was like trying to hide from some monsters. And I knew that he was trying to get to the Westman Islands. And it was like a really vivid dream.

And then I woke up, and I was like really curious. I was like, like, who were these monsters And what, what could like wipe out like the electricity in like all of Reykjavík? And like, where, where is everybody? And what is in the Western Islands? I had never been there at this point. So I yeah, and then like, just, I think it was the same week or something.

I had to decide if I was going to write my bachelor paper or like, what do you call it like my thesis, if I was gonna write it in like literature, like, and do like theoretical paper and something, or if I was going to write it in like the creative writing department.

And then I didn’t have like an idea for a story.So I was like, Oh, I can write about that. And yeah, so I wrote like the first version of Vetrarhörkur for like my, my bachelor, like, project. And it was only I was a novella, I was like 60 pages or something. And then I decided to like, yeah.

IAC:
And Rúv gave this a audio treatment last year. So there’s that was, and the the actors were amazing. And it seemed very, the whole thing seemed very true to the book.

HK:
Yeah, so yeah, I wrote that. And so, yes, so I sold the like the TV rights to these books. I think like, eight years ago or something. And they hired me to write, to write the like the scripts for that. So I wrote like an eight part series based on the books. And then they were like, Oh, no, we’re going to go another direction.

And so they like, and I think, I think it was a good call, actually, because like, I’m probably not the best person to, to like adapt this, because, yeah, I saw it like when I was writing the scripts, like, it’s really like, I’m trying to figure out like, what can the can an actor convey and like, yeah, no, so because I read books, and I think that’s like my, yeah, the best place for me.

But so I had these scripts, and then they paid me for them and everything. So yeah, and then like the option expired.

And Ruth, then as in a broadcasting agency asked me if I wanted to to adapt this for, for radio, or like radio drama. And I was like, Yeah, can I paste this on that? Because like, I had already like, watched the story and broken it down into eight episodes. And they were like, Yeah, sure. So I, so I kind of like rewrote the, the TV scripts for, for radio.

Yeah. And then I sold the rights again, the TV rights. So I think they are working on a TV series, Rúv Yes, or like, so it’s like, it’s an independent producer, but I think they’re in collaboration with Ruth. But I’ve, I’ve learned the hard way that like, TV and filmmakers are like the, like the most optimistic people in the world.They’re always like, yes, yes, yes, we’re gonna start filming in four months. And you know, then like, you know, I think you have to be like, super excited about everything, just to like function in this business, because everything takes like a horribly long time. And it’s so hard to get funding. But the last thing I heard was like, yeah, we’re gonna start filming in 2024. So I don’t know.

IAC:
As soon as anything moves on that, please let us know.

HK:
Yeah.

IAC:
We’re coming close to time. I have so much here I could probably do a part.

But I mean, I’m not for last.

Okay, great.

So I have, because there is I would also love to hear more about it. I’m reading that right now. I’m on chapter four. It’s been a challenge for me. And I think I’ve taken so many notes out of this book, I’ve probably plagiarized you.

HK:
Yeah, I also make up a lot of words there.

IAC:
Oh, okay.

HK:
Yeah, I make up some words.

IAC:
So that’s my yes. Yeah, this one’s been a bit more challenging for me to read. Okay. But no, it’s the story so far is great. Especially right around kind of where kind of where the main character and her father talking and she realizes he’s telling her he’s like, hey, you should become a teacher. And she’s like, No, I could never I could never know when to move the tribe between between these different places. It is just a really right around page 24 or 25. That conversation. So heartwarming. Like, I don’t know, it’s it made me think of my own kid. So am I in for more part heart-wrenching moments in that book? Um, prepare myself?

HK:
Yeah, probably. So I had to like, this is the book that I’ve had to rewrite the most out of all of my books. And it’s been interesting. So it came out like, five or six weeks ago or something. And like the reviews that I’ve gotten are kind of like, always a bit different from what Hinter has been writing. Because usually I’m quite plot driven. So like, I get the plot, like that’s the like the first thing that pops into my mind, I get the plot and then like, and I plot them out. But this time, I like, first, I got the idea for like the like the world. And I was like, because I think it’s just one thing is that is sad about Iceland is there’s not a lot of animals here. So like with mammals, it’s only like, so I think like foxes and like seals, or if you talk about like, lantern foxes are kind of like the only animals that weren’t brought here by people, maybe mouse, mouse, like mice also, but like rats and, you know, minks and like sheep and cows, like everything was brought by humans.So we don’t have a lot of animals here.

And then I read somewhere that so like humans as a species, we are the only species that have like moved up in the food chain, because we used to be somewhere on the middle of the food chain. So we were eaten by animals, and we also ate animals. But through innovation, we have like moved to the top of the food chain. But like biologically, we are still, you know, and some people say that like, that’s where our anxiety comes from. Because like, we’re used to like, we’re wired to be always like on the lookout for danger, because like, there could be something eating you. So I got really fascinated about like, how, how would the society like a human society with like people that are like, like us, how would it look like being in the middle of the food chain? And how, like, what’s it like? Is it like, oh, we’re sad. Oh, no, no, he got eaten yesterday, you know, so he’s not coming, you know, or I was just like trying to imagine like, how, how would that feel?And how would that look like? So and, and then came this idea, I also read with reading about the mekafana, which is like a biological concept, which we have like, really big animals.And like I was saying before, like, usually, an idea for me is like three ideas coming together, you know, and so I decided to write about Iceland.But like with really, really big animals, where people are somewhere in the middle of the food chain.

And Hrím happened.

And so basically, so I was talking to my friend, and he was like, oh, it’s like a cozy fantasy, with like, cozy fantasy has been like big thing in fantasy, whereas like, low stakes. And by that, I mean, it’s not like, oh, the world is anything and we have to like, do this, you know, so it’s like, low stakes in the world. But I mean, of course, it can be high stakes, like, in the personal life of people. So it’s kind of just like people living their lives, and fighting to survive in a world that’s quite different to ours.

And I also thought it was really funny, because like, so in Iceland, I mean, of course, we fear nature, but we fear like the elements we feel the cold, and the weather, but we’re not used to fearing like animals. So there comes a scene and you’re not there yet. But like, they have to cross a river. And it’s really dangerous to cross a river because the salmons are so big that they can eat you, you know, wow. And also they’re like, like collecting eiderdown. And it’s really like, you have, like, if you’re doing that, and the bird comes back, you’re in big trouble, you know, so Oh, her, her little brother was attacked.

IAC:
Yeah, yeah, by an owl.

Like the owl could have.

HK:
Yes.

So yeah, I had a lot of fun with that, like, making the animals bigger and putting in like lots of danger.

IAC:
Yeah.

Well, I have to I have to contrast the reviews. Because I’ve always admired your stuff because of the world building, because of the detail to even street names. And just, like I said, it’s fun just to fall imagine the characters walking around on a map that I have that I leave open while I’m reading the book.

Um, yes, so if you were willing, I would love to do a part two later on.

More to follow…